What Is the Message Here?


#1

[quote]Homeless man’s life celebrated
WebPosted Jul 6 2004 02:05 PM PDT

VICTORIA - Dozens of people turned out Tuesday in Victoria to celebrate the life of a homeless man who died last week.

54-year-old Gilbert Dallaire had lived in the square beside Victoria City Hall.

Mourners marked his death in a poignant ceremony with a political message.

The service for Dallaire was lead by Reverend Al Tysick – a champion of the homeless in Victoria.

Dallaire never got much recognition in life. But now his death has become a public event in Victoria.

Many of his old friends turned out for the memorial service at The Open Door, a street ministry in downtown Victoria.

Dallaire was an alcoholic who had been on and off the street for years. Last year he lost his home when the city closed a number of rundown rooming houses.

Reverend Tysick says there was nowhere for Dallaire to go – so he camped at Centennial Square outside City Hall.

He finally died in hospital of apparent liver failure.

Reverend Tysick remembers Gilbert Dallaire as a quiet and gentle man.

Mourners hope that Dallaire’s legacy is a society that opens its doors to the homeless. [/quote]

So does this basically say, sure go ahead and drink your life away. You deserve recognition for your liver damage. The media really makes me wonder sometimes. :unamused:


#2

No, it’s conveying the message that some people feel sorry for the man, regardless of how he ended up. Obviously he was well known to some people, and they want to give him the treatment he deserves. Just because he had a disease doesn’t make him any less of a human being.


#3

Its about dying with dignity. Its unfortunate that he died the way he did. But its about remembering the person. He was human, no one should have to die alone. That would have to be the most tragic thing of all. To not be remembered at all. Doesnt matter how he lived or died. He is being remembered for being human.

You got the wrong message from that. You are way too cynical and I dont agree with you on this whatsoever.

If you died alone, in a hospital and no one came to your funeral to celebrate your life, loves etc, not that you’d care, you would be dead but that would be sad.

At least people wanted to remember him and celebrate his life, however he may have lived. He was still a person.


#4

That was pretty pessimistic and negative of me to state that, however, I am by no means cynical as a person. Maybe on the internet I come across as someone I am not, but don’t we all?
Prudence, in my eyes, is simply an online character I have created. Not all of us will be the first ones to admit that they create different online characters, but I will.
But back to the original topic, I just thought the story was very vague and gave the wrong impression.


#5

[quote=“Prudence”]That was pretty pessimistic and negative of me to state that, however, I am by no means cynical as a person. Maybe on the internet I come across as someone I am not, but don’t we all?
Prudence, in my eyes, is simply an online character I have created. Not all of us will be the first ones to admit that they create different online characters, but I will.
But back to the original topic, I just thought the story was very vague and gave the wrong impression.[/quote]

Prudence,

Don’t worry about your online character being different or similar to yourself in real life. All of us are a little more biting and cynical here than if we actually had a discussion face to face. That is why it is fun to post here.

I think the article was meant to show that closing rundown rooming houses has consequences if nothing else is provided. It was probably written by a social activist news reporter who wanted some kind of impact.
It follows the same kind of thing as when Jack Layton linked the rising homeless death toll with Paul Martin’s financial decisions. It gets the media attention ( with justification.)
As for the poor soul, he probably gave up hope. He probably made some bad choices in the past and decided that it was too late to turn his life around. In the end, people gathered around to mourn him because he became some kind of symbol of our society’s flaws regarding people who fall through it’s cracks. But there will always be cracks.
About the choices Dallaire made, it reminds me of the teen drinking thread where some have come to say that some teens will just drink and party, no matter what parents do or discuss. I wonder if these people understand how easy it is to become addicted to alcohol and how this addiction can kill you like the fellow in the article?


#6

Google ads on this page all have liver in them…how to fight liver problems, facts on liver disease.


#7

Speaking of closing rundown buildings, when is the BC Government going to combine Rupert’s two high schools into one? Isn’t it about time they end this wastefulness??


#8

I don’t think it’s a provincial job – I believe its the school district.


#9

Could either school handle the number of students? I don’t know what CHSS is like, but PRSS couldn’t.


#10

It could if you shift it - half the students go to school 7:00am to Noon, the other half Noon to 5:00pm.


#11

You suck at the Internet.


#12

You suck at Putting On Steering Wheels.


#13

We already had a junior and a senior high school here, until CHSS was built and opened in 1992. There’s no way the school district or the government would make certain kids go to school at certain times, in favour of having 2 schools working at the same time.


#14

Oh I know, it’s a crazy idea, but in this age of cutbacks, don’t be surprised when they privatize the schools… whichever big company wins the contract to run the schools may think up that kind of cost-saving measure…


#15

The story’s about how shabby our social support system has become. They closed the guy’s rooming house and he ends up on the street. The Social Service employees don’t try to find the guy a new home, he’s a wino, who cares even if the university course they took says alcoholism is a disease. They’re job is to find ways to disqualify you. Very simple, someone walks into the office, you find a way to NOT help them. THat’s what it’s about.
Easiest way is to no help the guy find accomodation. Then he has no address to qualify. Next is to drain them of every penny so they close their bank account. THen they don’t qualify cuz there’s nowhere to put the money.
Liberal way is to close the local office. THey have to travel to another town to make appointments where they get insulted and threatened and harrassed. Then you can make an appointment for someone at 9 am knowing full well the bus (which they need to borrow money for) doesn’t get into town until 11 am. That gives you the right to call the applicant a slacker and deny them cuz they ‘couldn’t even show up on time’. and send them away til next month.
Sure this is all good for some dogf***ing 30 year old bum, but if you’re sick, alcoholic, mentally or physically challenged you get screwed over too. THe only way to get welfare is to be a single person (female or male with a lawyer) with kids. Then you will get the bare minimum of civility.
You might even run into someone who remembers what their job IS instead of what it’s defined as now.
This is me being cynical, I used to know a lot of people who knew every angle to cheat welfare. 3rd generation welfare bums, raising the 4th. Now I see too much of the other side, in trying to get rid of those people we’ve shafted the people who need it. THe ones our tax money is supposed to look after, not their ageing parents, kids or church.
THe schizo with no one making sure he takes his pills so he’s knocking on your door at 2 am about the satanists holding meetings in your yard.
The guy with Lou Gehrig’s you have to help into the elevator to upstaris to the lawyer, because all they’ll give him is ‘transit fare’ to welfare, and there is no transit.
THe guy who’s wife walked out and left him with two pre-school kids, and he’s so geeky he can’t walk a straight line let alone last 2 hours in the gyppo mill.
The five or six single moms on this block that have 3 kids and can’t start an entry level job without losing medical, dental and special ed for the kids.


#16

There are always going to be misfortunes of that sort. Bottom line is that we have all had chances to be somebodies (or atleast obide by the welfare system if we do not have the mental capacity to hold a job.)
Welfare is not that hard to get. People make the cutbacks sound worse than they really are. A friend of mine collects welfare, yes I am a friend of a ‘welfare bum.’ She can collect welfare as long as she needs to, as long as she proves she is looking for work.
Yes jobs can be hard to find these days. But a person can not go for two years without atleast finding a job in a corner store or fastfood joint.
Unfortunately the government went about the whole welfare system all wrong years ago and left it wide open for people to take advantage of. And now they are kicking themselves in the ass for it and finally implementing rules.
If only the Canadian government can study the success of a few States who have done away with the welfare system and are now educating their people for FREE.


#17

[quote=“Prudence”]

[quote]Homeless man’s life celebrated
WebPosted Jul 6 2004 02:05 PM PDT

VICTORIA - Dozens of people turned out Tuesday in Victoria to celebrate the life of a homeless man who died last week.

54-year-old Gilbert Dallaire had lived in the square beside Victoria City Hall.

Mourners marked his death in a poignant ceremony with a political message.

The service for Dallaire was lead by Reverend Al Tysick – a champion of the homeless in Victoria.

Dallaire never got much recognition in life. But now his death has become a public event in Victoria.

Many of his old friends turned out for the memorial service at The Open Door, a street ministry in downtown Victoria.

Dallaire was an alcoholic who had been on and off the street for years. Last year he lost his home when the city closed a number of rundown rooming houses.

Reverend Tysick says there was nowhere for Dallaire to go – so he camped at Centennial Square outside City Hall.

He finally died in hospital of apparent liver failure.

Reverend Tysick remembers Gilbert Dallaire as a quiet and gentle man.

Mourners hope that Dallaire’s legacy is a society that opens its doors to the homeless. [/quote]

So does this basically say, sure go ahead and drink your life away. You deserve recognition for your liver damage. The media really makes me wonder sometimes. :unamused:[/quote]

I’m pretty sure they were trying to capitalize on his death to point out the lack of low cost housing issue.

I heard that story somewhere else and it also mentioned that he had just recently gone back to the streets because some of the low cost homes that he had stayed in previously had shut down.

I mean, think about it. In life he was just some harmless alcoholic who ended up homeless, who cares? In death he’s a prime example of society failing the poor. So therefore we celebrate his death. Good ol’ society, always so righteous in hindsight. Always so lacking in foresight.


#18

[quote=“Prudence”]There are always going to be misfortunes of that sort. Bottom line is that we have all had chances to be somebodies (or atleast obide by the welfare system if we do not have the mental capacity to hold a job.)
Welfare is not that hard to get. People make the cutbacks sound worse than they really are. A friend of mine collects welfare, yes I am a friend of a ‘welfare bum.’ She can collect welfare as long as she needs to, as long as she proves she is looking for work.
Yes jobs can be hard to find these days. But a person can not go for two years without atleast finding a job in a corner store or fastfood joint.
Unfortunately the government went about the whole welfare system all wrong years ago and left it wide open for people to take advantage of. And now they are kicking themselves in the ass for it and finally implementing rules.
If only the Canadian government can study the success of a few States who have done away with the welfare system and are now educating their people for FREE.[/quote]

I think it’s very narrow minded to think that everybody has had a chance to become a somebody. A lot of winos or whatever you see on the street were somebodies. They just had a run of bad luck, or developed an addiction. There will always be a few people on the street who we can easily look down on as dirtbags and nobodies. But they deserve to be treated like humans.

Welfare is a piss poor excuse for a living. I was listening to CBC radio today when they said something about housing. Apparently a working person spends about 30-35% of their income on housing, whereas a person on welfare spends closer to 65 or 70% of their income. That leaves very little to buy things such as food, clothes, or any ot her basic needs. Not to mention that there is a good chance they also have an addiction that they need to consider. Lets not be so narrow minded as to say that that is their fault and that they have a choice, blah blah blah, just try to imagine what they go through.


#19

[quote=“TranscendingRationality”]

Welfare is not that hard to get. People make the cutbacks sound worse than they really are. A friend of mine collects welfare, yes I am a friend of a ‘welfare bum.’ She can collect welfare as long as she needs to, as long as she proves she is looking for work.
Yes jobs can be hard to find these days. But a person can not go for two years without atleast finding a job in a corner store or fastfood joint.
Unfortunately the government went about the whole welfare system all wrong years ago and left it wide open for people to take advantage of. And now they are kicking themselves in the ass for it and finally implementing rules.
If only the Canadian government can study the success of a few States who have done away with the welfare system and are now educating their people for FREE.

I think it’s very narrow minded to think that everybody has had a chance to become a somebody. A lot of winos or whatever you see on the street were somebodies. They just had a run of bad luck, or developed an addiction. There will always be a few people on the street who we can easily look down on as dirtbags and nobodies. But they deserve to be treated like humans.

Welfare is a piss poor excuse for a living. I was listening to CBC radio today when they said something about housing. Apparently a working person spends about 30-35% of their income on housing, whereas a person on welfare spends closer to 65 or 70% of their income. That leaves very little to buy things such as food, clothes, or any ot her basic needs. Not to mention that there is a good chance they also have an addiction that they need to consider. Lets not be so narrow minded as to say that that is their fault and that they have a choice, blah blah blah, just try to imagine what they go through.[/quote]

Like I said, I can empathize with what they are going through. I am friends with a person who is going through the whole welfare situation. But how hard is it to hand out resumes and prove you are looking for work? Or how hard is it to visit a physician to discuss your incapabilities, whether it would be a handicapp, mental issue, or drug addiction?? Not hard at all. I witnessed this first hand, with my friend.
And who said they don’t deserve to be treated like humans???


#20

I doubt many homeless people are there by choice. How easy is it to hand out resumes and get a job when you’re dirty, undereducated, living on the street, and a known wino? How easy is it for people not in that position, who have jobs, to look down at a ‘bum’ and criticize. Until I meet that bum personally, know how he got there and determine that yeah, he is in fact just a lazy ass who likes sleeping on the street collecting pop cans and drinking rice wine better than dealing with moder day society, then I’ll give “bums” the benifit of the doubt. And if someone is there of their own choosing then maybe I’ll even respect that.

I’ve never agreed much with society, government, or people myself.