Rupert residents trending towards apathy over civic issues

Gosh, my heart goes out to the lady. What an ordeal. Thanks for bringing it to our attention. You’d think that the owner of the “Mussallem” apartments would pony up and look after the tenants. So many people had destruction and interruption, hopefully all is restored very soon. On a side issue; I’ve heard there has been a lot of vandalism along 3rd, and wonder who collects on the property insurance policy payouts? Empty buildings costing money are vandalized, and suddenly, they’re transformed into cash cows…hmmm

Nice condescending contribution, think you could bring a bigger blanket next time?

Here’s an interesting update for those businesses in Cow Bay. Do a Google map search of Prince Rupert and zoom in on Cow Bay. Notice how only Breakers Pub, Dolly’s Fish Market and Homework appear in Cow Bay? You’d think if tourism was doing its job, and the city was doing its job, and the province was doing its job, that Prince Rupert maps would display evey business and service. EVERYWHERE in Prince Rupert. Hmmm…

and I just noticed, the map doesn’t even display PR City Hall!

Obviously somebody is asleep at the helm…or deliberately is running it onto the rocks…

[quote=“wildwill”]Here’s an interesting update for those businesses in Cow Bay. Do a Google map search of Prince Rupert and zoom in on Cow Bay. Notice how only Breakers Pub, Dolly’s Fish Market and Homework appear in Cow Bay? You’d think if tourism was doing its job, and the city was doing its job, and the province was doing its job, that Prince Rupert maps would display evey business and service. EVERYWHERE in Prince Rupert. Hmmm…

and I just noticed, the map doesn’t even display PR City Hall!

Obviously somebody is asleep at the helm…or deliberately is running it onto the rocks…[/quote]

I am not a business owner, but you have me curious. How would a business get its name on a google map?

[quote=“DWhite”][/quote]

I am not a business owner, but you have me curious. How would a business get its name on a google map?

It’s easy and it’s free. This link will tell you how to do it - hubpages.com/hub/How-do-you-put- … oogle-Maps

[quote=“dabbledon”]
It’s easy and it’s free. This link will tell you how to do it - hubpages.com/hub/How-do-you-put- … oogle-Maps[/quote]

Seems pretty straight forward.

I wonder how many businesses, especially ones who cater to out of towners, are aware of how easy it is.

Not sure if it is fair to blame the city for an individual business’s decision to not put a name on a map, but now that the information is out there (or at least here on HTMF) will people take advantage of the service.

It is easy and straight forward, and makes a HUGE difference in page ranking with Google. I agree that each business has its responsibility, but so does local government that has the responsibility of promoting economic development.

Even if all the businesses are negligent in getting on Google maps, what is City Hall’s excuse? You’d think that would have been the first of any. Like I said, somebody is asleep at the helm, or is intentionally steering for the rocks…

[quote=“wildwill”]Political apathy is usually the result of political boredom. Boredom is brought about by electing the same old, same old, and expecting different results. A classic example is Jack Mussallem. In my opinion Jack is a nice enough guy when he needs to be, but he is at best nothing more than a social leech. He has haunted Prince Rupert’s city hall for decades, in multiple capacities, with varying degrees of (in)competence.

The reality is that Jack is just a follower, not a leader. His years of being a public servant prove that he is only capable of working ‘within’ a prestructured environment. He is entirely incapable of ‘creating’ a new one. He has been a huge detriment to Prince Rupert for decades, forestalling and obstructing any development unless he personally profited. Why the heck people in Rupert haven’t tarred, feathered and run his butt out of town is beyond me. Rupert needs a mover, shaker, creator, energizer - none of which describe Jack. Yet, he’s mayor. Wake up Prince Rupert, the town has had a steady population decline every since he first became involved in city politics. Go figure!

The truth is that the old guard and city bureaucrats, who are extreme protectionists in every way, have driven the community to its knees. The good news is that many of them are dying or moving away, finally! The bad news is that Jack is their esteemed leader. Few non-First Nations families have been in Rupert longer than his. Until the citizens of Rupert elect a mayor and council who have a enormous drive to develop Rupert, and a “get the ‘f…k’ out of our way be-otch” attitude toward the old guard and bureaucrats, the town is NOT going to develop to any real degree (attracting less than a 1,000 new citizens in 20 years to the world’s 5th largest ice free deep water port is a really, really good indication that either idiots, and/or protectionists, are in control).

Until there is political excitement and tangible growth perceived by the citizens, apathy will be the best you can expect. If Jack Musallem is the best that Rupert can find to lead them into the future, the town is woefully doomed. The people of Rupert need to see and reach for things out of the box that Jack built.[/quote]

I would love to vote for the" mover, shaker, creator, etc. " which you speak of here. I did not however see that name on the ballot last election day. What I saw was Jack or Don…what a choice and don’t get me going on that.
If you- WildWill" are that person, THEN LETS HAVE YOU ON THE BALLOT.
Trouble is I did not see the many of the right people running which means we had a choice of- the maybe, the bad and worse on council and the mayoral seat ( I won’t say which was which in my opinion).
I could not agree more with what most of what you’ve said here but it’s easy to blame and rant but please, for the love of God, suggest who the right people might be and when they will be running for civic elections. I for one can’t wait for this new order to begin.
Once that is done maybe someone can get an administrator that will get off their ass and be accountable for the work getting done with our tax dollars rather than sit in the office between meetings and collect a huge check while things continue to get worse and worse.

[quote=“BOW”] … I would love to vote for the" mover, shaker, creator, etc. " which you speak of here. I did not however see that name on the ballot last election day. What I saw was Jack or Don…what a choice and don’t get me going on that.
If you- WildWill" are that person, THEN LETS HAVE YOU ON THE BALLOT.
Trouble is I did not see the many of the right people running which means we had a choice of- the maybe, the bad and worse on council and the mayoral seat ( I won’t say which was which in my opinion).
I could not agree more with what most of what you’ve said here but it’s easy to blame and rant but please, for the love of God, suggest who the right people might be and when they will be running for civic elections. I for one can’t wait for this new order to begin.
Once that is done maybe someone can get an administrator that will get off their ass and be accountable for the work getting done with our tax dollars rather than sit in the office between meetings and collect a huge check while things continue to get worse and worse.[/quote]

Sorry Bow, you mentioned Ballot and I was trying to recall the numbers back in 2008.
So when the elections happened in fall of 2008, I understood the numbers were the same as published on HTMF. So if the total of ballots is correct as submitted by Dan Rodin 3776 – 1838 (Mussallem) – 1646 (Scott) = 292 that did not choose a Mayor (numbers on Sunday).

So looking at the PR web site and recalculating the numbers: 3776 -1919 (Mussallem) – 1762 (Scott) = 95. Guess 95 looks better than close to 300 who would not vote for either one.

I do not understand why there was a difference from Sunday’s total to Wednesday’s? Perhaps someone can help me understand. Thank you. There were still some voters who did not vote for either or. Also the difference in numbers from Sunday to Wednesday, perhaps they should not publish numbers until it is official?

Prince Rupert web site results: princerupert.ca/images/edito … esults.pdf

Mussallem 1919
Scott 1762

Local Government 2008 Elections: elections.civicinfo.bc.ca/20 … ts2008.asp

Mussallem 1919
Scott 1762

Chief Election Officer: Dan Rodin
Phone: 250-627-0935
E-mail Address: dan.rodin@princerupert.ca
Updated: 16/11/2008 12:46:28 AM
Total Number of Ballots Cast: 3776
Estimated Number of Eligible Voters: 9110
% Turnout: 41.45%
Councillors to be Elected: 6

Northern View Results:
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=10957&start=30
Topic on HTMF RE: Elections Results.
by TheNorthernView » Sun Nov 16, 2008 12:20 am
Posting here and on the other section of the site, with the numbers and trustee outcome.

At 12:05 a.m. on Sunday morning, the City of Prince Rupert released the unofficial results of the 2008 municipal election.

In the race for Mayor, Jack Mussallem defeated Don Scott by a tally of 1,838 to 1,646.
by Cst. Ferman » Sun Nov 16, 2008 2:43 am
Here’s the Numerical List of the lucky buggers:

MAYOR: 1836 - Jack Mussallem 1646 - Don Scott

COUNCIL:

1892 - Nelson Kinney
1891 - Joy Thorkelson
1863 - Shiela Gordon-Payne
1563 - Kathy Bedard
1429 - Anna Ashley
1418 - Gina Garon

by TheNorthernView » Wed Nov 19, 2008 5:34 pm
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=10957&start=75
Official results from the City of Prince Rupert, released today, show slightly different numbers than reported on Sunday.

Mayor: Jack Mussallem - 1,919 Don Scott - 1,762

Council:
Nelson Kinney - 1,982
Joy Thorkelson - 1,974
Sheila Gordon-Payne - 1,940
Kathy Bedard - 1,572
Anna Ashley - 1,487
Gina Garon - 1,479
Tony Briglio - 1,423

BettyBoop has written a list of election results which is fine, (although kind of frightening when we have to relive some of those choices).
I still want to know who is going to run in the future to replace the politicians we seem to be so displeased with. On top of that why is there so little concern going on about the City Administration at all? In my opinion the administration is wasting money hand over fist with little to no input from council and the mayor. If any try they are accused of “micromanaging”. What a crock!
I ask again who will run and really lead this city the way it needs to be lead?
If we don’t like what’s happening now, how do we fix the future of PR?

Sometimes I entertain ideas of running for council, because there is so much I would love to see happen, but honestly, I have zero experience on that front, and Rupertites have the same attitude towards their civic officials as Habs fans do towards their goalies. It’s not a sympathetic crowd.

I agree we need energetic, vibrant people with ideas. Maybe we could vote in a bloc so that there’s a united effort of will towards turning this place around.

We used to call it a slate , where a group would focus in together on issues that needed to be addressed . I have entertained running again if I do not leave the village by then , I took pride in taking my seat years ago and I never lost touch with the people who got me my seat . I never had experience either when I ran but I was going into it with the people behind me , I frequented the coffee shops as usual and listened to the people. I remember my first Sea Fest Parade and we were driving around in little Golf carts , I was following Ted Keen’s band , so I would ask to stop and I would get out and dance with people , I was told that we are not to do this but I said shit they put me in my seat and I am going to dance and laugh with the folks.

Hey, fun is fun, but I think the time for golf carts and dancing in the streets are not what is needed at this point…maybe???
Wildwill had a bunch of stuff going on this post about what should be and who was not doing their job, I still want to know if Wildwill is all show and no go, or do you have some people you know who can help. Maybe we can dance in the streets and drive goofy little cars then?
If Justin Case had their turn, then great, let’s move on to someone who may turn things around.
Let’s try to stay focused here people.

The point I was trying to make is once someone is privileged enough to be elected they should remember who put them in their seat . Yes I would probably give it another go .

Go for it.

Just promise to vote against every motion that involves secrecy, secret meetings, etc, and you’ll win.

I am in no way criticizing anybody here, but what this town lacks is a vision. We are still wrapped up in the Charles Hays vision of 1910. The city seems to be sitting back waiting for the port to magically make us wealthy and/or the old pulp mill site to suddenly sprout an industry that will magically give us the 1000 or so jobs that have been lost since the mill closed and the fishing industry collapsed.

I am not sure what it will take, but it doesn’t all have to come from the people we elect. There are people working in city hall with ideas. There are some pretty smart business people with ideas on what might be possible. There are social activists who have ideas on what needs to be done to make our city a better place to live. For various reasons many of these people do not have the time to be on council for three years. Or maybe like guitargirl they figure they don’t have the expertise to do all of the work of council but they still have ideas that they can contribute in certain areas.

I don’t know if they exist, but perhaps mayor and council should organize committes and invite some of these people to participate in organizing some sort of vision on a specific topic. The process might take a few months. Off the top of my head, Anna as an elected person who I know is interested in recreation and Rudy as the top guy at the Civic Centre can organize a group to look at recreation in the city. They can ask for volunteers but they can also “twist” some arms. They can call a public meeting like the ones that are poorly attended, but even if the ones I am suggesting are poorly attended there is still a working committee to make suggestions. At the end of the process, they offer something to the public through council.

Each council member can head a committee in an area they feel passionate about. Just rambling at this point, but I think people get my drift.

[quote=“MiG”]

Go for it.

Just promise to vote against every motion that involves secrecy, secret meetings, etc, and you’ll win.[/quote]

That is a good promise to make, but looking at the voting records it’s also a promise that some council members (one in particular comes to mind) have trouble keeping.

What you say about committees raises an interesting point. In other towns and cities council members hold portfolios or sit on particular committees. That’s part of how they do business. Let’s go on a tour of quite a bit of the province. We’ll move right along, we won’t linger.

Here’s a link showing the portfolios and committee appointments of the City of Terrace council members: terrace.ca/city_hall/mayor_a … ncil_bios/

Let’s head up Hwy 16 to Smithers. Here’s the committee appointments for their council members: smithers.ca/index.php/munici … l-members/

Village of Burns Lake. Here’s the committees their council members have been appointed to: burnslake.ca/village/24/mayor+and+council

Here’s a link to Village of Vanderhoof’s committee appointments: stuartnechako.ca/vanderhoof/muni … ommittees/

Not surprisingly, City of Prince George council members sit on a lot of committees, some of which appear to be council appointments while others appear to be on their own initiative: city2.princegeorge.ca/CityHall/M … fault.aspx

Let’s take a right turn down Hwy 97. Here’s the portfolios and committee appointments for the City of Quesnel council members: city.quesnel.bc.ca/Council/Q … s-2007.asp

Continuing along to Williams Lake, here’s their council members’ various portfolios: williamslake.ca/index.asp?p=136

After that, it’s mostly rather small places until one gets to the big smoke, but I wouldnt be surprised if some of the councils of those little hamlets have seen fit to appoint their council members to portfolios and committees as well.

So let’s return to City of Prince Rupert and look at the current roster of elected council members: princerupert.ca/councilors.php

What are their portfolios? What committees do they sit on? What matters of concern to the citizenry are certain council members tasked to pay particular attention to and perhaps talk to citizens about? I honestly don’t know. Maybe we’ve drawn a blank here. Citizens are appointed to bodies like the library board, the airport society and so on, and the Health Committee was somewhat controversially shut down, but those are different issues.

What committees do council members sit on or what portfolios are they appointed to that actually play a part in how City Hall operates?

A couple of council members are appointed to the Skeena-Queen Charlotte Regional District, but the city is legally required to make appointments to that not so illustrious body that sucks a lot of money out of the wallets of Rupert taxpayers. I think that citizens would be alarmed if they tallied up how much it costs them and considered how little they get back in services (a local recycling centre that’s been cut back). Those appointments, by the way, pay an honouraria of about $10K a year; not bad for a board meeting once a month. But anyway, back to the topic at hand.

A lot of dissatisfaction with the city council is expressed on this forum. That’s pretty much a regular feature. On occasion others sign in and make allegations about some of us being ‘negative’ or ‘why don’t you put your name in and run next election’ (and shut up in the meantime), or ‘if you don’t like it why don’t you leave’ (sorry, some of us kind of like it here even though we have concerns) and so on. Then they depart without having made any better suggestions or contributions than the rest of us.

I think though, DWhite, that you’ve actually hit on something specific that is lacking here, and that could provide a basis for concrete, readily achievable suggestions to our reclusive city leadership. In towns and cities throughout the province elected council members are assigned portfolios, appointed to committees, or both. Some of those committees may be internal to the council; others may include non-elected members from the community. That’s all part of how they do business. But not here. Why is that? I wonder if anyone on council could provide an explanation?

When I was sitting on council we did have our own portfolios and we sat on committees as D White suggested.

I would bet that you were on council during the Lester era (or not long thereafter), when appointing councillors to portfolios and committees, such that they took responsibility for consulting with citizens and officials about particular issues, was how things were done and had been for a long time.

Correct me if I’m wrong, but the idea back then was that individual councillors, as part of their duties, were encouraged to develop a good understanding of issues (and not least of all of what citizens thought) within their portfolio and committee responsibilities.

It was more of a mayor and council style of government, with the administration playing a supporting role, than the current management and council way of doing things, where individual councillors seem not to take the initiative on issues unless the administration has given a recommendation or its blessings (councillors Ashley and Garon seem to be somewhat more independent in that regard). Would that be your assessment as a former councillor?

Which raises some questions. When did the practice of appointing councillors to portfolios and committees end. In other words, when did Rupert start to take what seems to be a rather scaled down approach to council member duties, compared to past practice here and how other towns and cities of similar or greater size conduct their business?

Who thought that was a good idea or recommended that change? Or did the mayor and council simply stop appointing council members to particular duties unless additional honouraria was attached to the position, as is the case when representing the city on the Regional District board?