16 Billion $ oil refinery in Kitimat

You guys see this story yet. Holy stink.
thenorthernview.com/news/166557216.html
Plans announced for $13 billion oil refinery in the northwest

David Black - the owner and president of Black Press which owns newspapers throughout BC including the Prince Rupert Northern View - announced this morning plans to construct a $13 billion oil refinery in the Kitimat area.
Black incorporated a company called Kitimat Clean Ltd., which plans to build a refinery 25 kilometres south of Terrace large enough to process all of the capacity from the Northern Gateway pipeline to be shipped out. The plant would process up to 550,000 barrels per day of dibit to be shipped back to Edmonton, 240,000 barrels per day of diesel, 100,000 barrels per day of gasoline and 50,000 barrels per day of kerosene. The product would then be shipped to a marine terminal site in Kitimat that is currently planned to be used for the Enbridge crude oil shipping terminal.
“The refinery will eliminate any chance of a crude oil spill from shipping through Kitimat. Gasoline, kerosene and diesel, which are the products from the refinery all float and are all evaporative,” explained Black.
According to Black, processing the oil before it is shipped out will remove the threat of offshore pollution from heavy cruise due to the evaporative properties of kerosene, gasoline and diesel.
Construction plans call for groundbreaking in 2014, with the facility complete in 2020. During the five year construction period, an estimated 6,000 workers would be needed, while another 3,000 permanent jobs would be created during operation, with half of those being provided through private contractors.
Prior to the submission of the environmental assessment application earlier this morning, Kitimat Clean Ltd. has spoken to the different levels of government about the project, have reviewed the project with investment bankers and been told the revenues and profits are enough to enable equity and debt financing, have discussed the plans with Enbridge and other oil sands producers and brought on-board a refinery consultant.
However, the $13 billion for the construction of the project has not been confirmed.
“The money for the environmental assessment has been put up. It will take about two years for the assessment, and while we’re doing that we’ll be talking to industry and customers in Asia and getting the rest of the financing in place,” said Black, noting that not all of the partners in the Northern Gateway project are in favour of a refinery as opposed to shipping the oil.
“If there is no Enbridge pipeline there is no refinery. And if we don’t believe the pipeline can be built in a way that ensures any leaks will be immaterial then it shouldn’t be built.”
However serious discussions with the Haisla and the Kitselas, on whose traditional territories the terminal and refinery would be located respectively, have not taken place. Art Sterritt of the Coastal First Nations, however, says more work needs to be done with other groups along the shipping line.
“The air pollution and impact from this refinery will have the same impact on the area, and removing the problem for the Skeena and the Nass is not solving half of the problem…You’re going to be polluting that area even more so,” said Art Sterrit of the Coastal First Nations.
“If you’re serious about doing business in the north, you need to be out there .”
Look for more on this story at thenorthernview.com as it becomes available.

At least if they were intending (read: contractually obligated to) on refining it here the pipeline would be at least a little bit palatable but even still it should be refined closer to the source so we arent pumping bitumen down our rivers.

It looks like a great idea, but I think it is doomed. For starters, Asia already has refining capacity. They don’t want to buy refined product, they want crude and can refine it cheaper than we can. There is no market for it in this country because we already refine more than we use. The only way I see this working is if it was to be an upgrading facility, from bitumen to synthetic crude.

We refine more than we can use? really? is that why every time something happens at a refinery in I don’t know say california we see a gas price increase here? which is it we rely on external sources or are self sufficient? That said any refinery would be better built closer to the source.

I listened to Mr. Black on the CBC this morning, and he said we don’t refine in Canada, I believe he is right, it goes to the states to be processed, the Americans do not send raw or unrefined oil as its against their law it needs to be refined before going over sees, so we send them our raw material and then they refine it. I agree we need to do that in Canada and in doing so we will create more jobs that will stay in Canada and not CHINA or AMERICA. Stop out sourcing JOB’s

When there is a fire at refinery in California it reduces their capacity, so they will buy it from us. Since gasoline is a commodity that extra demand drives the price up. Hence higher prices for us.

Don’t get me wrong, I would really like to see this built in Kitimat, I just have my doubts it will happen. But with all things, if there is a demand the money will follow.

You misunderstood him. We do refine in Canada, there are about 20 refineries in Canada. Two in BC (PG and Burnaby). However, we do also sell bitumen and crude to the states.

The USA is the biggest consumer and importer of crude, so of course they don’t export it. Canada, on the other hand produces way more than we use. Because we are a resource rich country we export. This is what drives the economy and pays for roads and hospitals and schools. We can’t sell just within Canada, where would the growth be? That’s like owning a business and only selling to your family. We have to export, I think the question is do we sell bitumen or crude?

A prominent, successful BC businessman proposes a multi-billion project in an area that has seen more than its share of decline, and all the MP for the area can say is “Ridiculous”?

Real classy Cullen.

[quote=“crazy Horse”]A prominent, successful BC businessman proposes a multi-billion project in an area that has seen more than its share of decline, and all the MP for the area can say is “Ridiculous”?

Real classy Cullen.[/quote]

He does give reasons as to why he finds the proposal ridiculous.

UPDATE: MP says plans for oil refinery ‘ridiculous’, MLA calls it ‘pie in the sky’ idea

[quote=“crazy Horse”]

When there is a fire at refinery in California it reduces their capacity, so they will buy it from us. Since gasoline is a commodity that extra demand drives the price up. Hence higher prices for us.

Don’t get me wrong, I would really like to see this built in Kitimat, I just have my doubts it will happen. But with all things, if there is a demand the money will follow.[/quote]

It shouldnt happen in kitimat it should happen in northern BC but thats beside the point. If as the oil companies like to say whenever they raise prices that there is limited supply of oil & gas then the chinese will be more than happy to buy our refined product and if they arent ready for that then they don’t need our unrefined products either. We deserve top dollar for our resources and selling it off at wholesale prices to enrich a few oil execs at the risk of the livelihoods of everyone in the north is not acceptable.

We already discount our oil to the Americans because we have no other market right now. Presumably the Chinese will pay more. I still don’t believe they will buy refined petroleum from us, they can get crude or bitumen from Venezuela or Africa.

So let them and when they need our supply then we develop it and sell it to them for a premium or we sell it to someone else who wants to pay a fair price now. Fuck the chinese and fuck the americans. Our oil resources can sit until we get a fair price. Liquidating our nations assets for fire sale prices in bulk with only short term gains in terms of the economy doesn’t make any sense unless you are one of the ones profiting to the tune of billions of dollars.

Yeah, or there’s that.

But one of the reasons we have a pretty decent standard of living is because of our resources and exports. A lot of jobs rely on it, the taxes pay for a lot of good things. Plus so many people rely on succesful companies (energy, transportation, exploration etc,) for their pensions or personal investments. It ain’t easy to live without these things.

[quote=“crazy Horse”]Yeah, or there’s that.

But one of the reasons we have a pretty decent standard of living is because of our resources and exports. A lot of jobs rely on it, the taxes pay for a lot of good things. Plus so many people rely on succesful companies (energy, transportation, exploration etc,) for their pensions or personal investments. It ain’t easy to live without these things.[/quote]

You’re right we do pretty well off our resource exports… specifically the value added ones where our citizens are paid to process said resources. Long term we all know what is better for the economy and its not short term gains by selling our resources off to be processed elsewhere. We shouldnt be exporting ANY raw resources from our country unless we just cant process them ourselves.

Thanks for the link to Mr. Cullen’s comments. After reading them I have to agree and see this proposal by media baron David Black as simply a “False Flag” attack on the opposition to Northern Gateway. By diverting the discussion from whether or not we should be pumping bitumen across Northern BC to a discussion about a mythical potential refinery in Northern BC, he’s serving the interest of one of his major advertisers.

I agree that we should be refining bitumen in Canada just like we should still be sawing our own logs rather than exporting them to China. Refining in Canada is a good idea, but refining it close to the source is a better idea.

Perhaps this makes more sense.

therealstory.ca/2012-08-18/bc-li … -thing-off

I noticed on the news tonite that the proposed refinery site will be 24 Kms. north of Kitimat. Wouldn’t that make it around the Onion lake area?

this refinery wont happen. its a ruse to get people to support the enbridge pipeline with the prospect of actual jobs for the region. I would hazard a guess someone is heavily invested in enbridge.

this refinery wont happen. its a ruse to get people to support the enbridge pipeline with the prospect of actual jobs for the region. I would hazard a guess someone is heavily invested in enbridge.

While I agree that this won’t happen, I think your reasoning is far fetched. I just don’t know who they think they will sell to. You can’t have the largest refinery on the west coast of North America and no customers.